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Post by ThirdMan on Nov 17, 2020 16:45:43 GMT -8
I don't really disagree with most of your points about S4 of Fargo (Chris Rock's work is solid to me, though), but I just figure they deviated from the usual tonal-clash simply because Hawley didn't want to repeat himself, as some accused Season 3 of doing (being a bit of a retread of Season 1). I think it remains a handsomely-produced, well-written and -acted series, and I'm not expecting much more than that from a TV show these days. I doubt they'll ever reach the heights of Season 2 again, but if this is the baseline quality of the show going forward (assuming there are more seasons to come), I'm fine with it.
And the most recent episode was wonderful, IMO.
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Post by Incandescence 112 on Dec 2, 2020 10:54:39 GMT -8
Well, the most recent of Fargo.....existed. Seriously though, one of the most cookie-cutter mob stories I've seen in quite some time. Nothing quite as aggravating as Season 3's low points, but this was for sure the most forgettable Fargo's ever been.
On the other hand, the writers of Adventure Time somehow kept the show fresh and fun for 8 straight years, and haven't lost their touch with Distant Lands. In particular, the most recent special is fantastic. It's a nice counterpoint to the Animaniacs disaster currently unfolding. Not exactly a fair comparison considering the gap in time is vastly different....but still--Distant Lands is how you follow up a beloved animated property.
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Post by Jeremy on Dec 2, 2020 19:35:46 GMT -8
Well, the most recent of Fargo.....existed. Seriously though, one of the most cookie-cutter mob stories I've seen in quite some time. Nothing quite as aggravating as Season 3's low points, but this was for sure the most forgettable Fargo's ever been. The season finale was less a standard finale than an epilogue for the show's many characters. It was a soft-pedaled conclusion to a soft-pedaled season. A number of standout scenes and one particularly strong episode ("East/West"), but this is not a season that will stick with me very long. It will probably be another few years before we get a fifth season; I'll still watch, but I'm not convinced the show is ever again going to hit the heights of its first two years. Adventure Time ended only two years ago, so certainly not fair to compare with Animaniacs. It's tough to revive any '90s property for the 2020s, so Animaniacs already had an uphill battle before it even premiered. Speaking of revived animated properties, DuckTales is ending after the current season. I've really liked the show overall, though Season Three has dragged in spots; hopefully, they give it a strong conclusion.
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Post by Incandescence 112 on Dec 2, 2020 20:55:21 GMT -8
Well, the most recent of Fargo.....existed. Seriously though, one of the most cookie-cutter mob stories I've seen in quite some time. Nothing quite as aggravating as Season 3's low points, but this was for sure the most forgettable Fargo's ever been. The season finale was less a standard finale than an epilogue for the show's many characters. It was a soft-pedaled conclusion to a soft-pedaled season. A number of standout scenes and one particularly strong episode ("East/West"), but this is not a season that will stick with me very long. It will probably be another few years before we get a fifth season; I'll still watch, but I'm not convinced the show is ever again going to hit the heights of its first two years. Adventure Time ended only two years ago, so certainly not fair to compare with Animaniacs. It's tough to revive any '90s property for the 2020s, so Animaniacs already had an uphill battle before it even premiered. Speaking of revived animated properties, DuckTales is ending after the current season. I've really liked the show overall, though Season Three has dragged in spots; hopefully, they give it a strong conclusion. Yeah, yeah....you knew it was just an excuse for me to praise Adventure Time.... Obsidian was right up my alley. I've really enjoyed DuckTales! I never thought the original was quite up there with the pre-2000s greats like Gargoyles or B:TAS, but the new version has been quite excellent in parts. For me, Fargo always proved Hawley's harsh critics wrong--its past two seasons have seen him succumb to his worst instincts as a writer. I'm still going to watch Season 5, though--those first two seasons are immaculately crafted. I've re-watched them multiple times.
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Post by Jeremy on Dec 3, 2020 8:47:41 GMT -8
Ah, you've watched Gargoyles? Great! So glad that show is widely available for streaming now.
I respect the original DuckTales more for its influence than its quality, though I maintain it holds up incredibly well. The new series is definitely a worth successor, even surpassing the original in several respects. And I stand by my statement that "The Duck Knight Returns!" is one of the best TV episodes I've seen in recent years.
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Post by Jeremy on Dec 7, 2020 15:50:17 GMT -8
Season Four of The Crown is one of the show's best - it's more focused than earlier years, with episodes oscillating between two larger arcs (apart from one midseason episode that feels like nothing the series has done previously). One of the arcs is very well-executed; the other is more hit and miss.
The stronger half is undeniably the Charles/Diana arc, which is charted across the '80s from its fairytale beginnings to the many bumps and headaches along the way. Emma Corrin is excellent as Diana, hitting all the right sympathetic notes and capturing the charm which made the real Princess a media darling for a solid decade. The season doesn't shy away from the toll the fame and a stressful marriage takes on her (more than one episode opens with a trigger warning about bulimia), but even while Charles displays some truly reprehensible behavior this season, Di isn't painted as truly saintly either.
The lesser half involves the rise of Margaret Thatcher and her frequent clashes with Queen Elizabeth, and while it's certainly not bad (the confrontational scenes between the two women are some of the season's standouts), the show hits a similar problem as Mrs. America did with Phyllis Schlafly - an inability to decide whether to portray a very controversial yet undeniably impactful woman whom the writers politically disagree with in a positive or negative light. The other issue is Gillian Anderson's performance (effectively guaranteed an Emmy nomination from the moment she was announced), which feels overly committal, underscoring Thatcher's tics to the point of distraction. You never believe you're watching Thatcher; you're always aware you're watching an actress playing Thatcher. The phrase "so good it's bad" may seem nonsensical, but it feels applicable here.
Still, the show remains eminently watchable on an episodic basis, and the character-focused episodes can hit pretty hard, even if we don't always know how true-to-life they are. The show remains a solid B, though it does hit B+/A- territory on several occasions.
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Post by guttersnipe on Dec 8, 2020 9:06:47 GMT -8
So I've never watched The Crown (I'm a die-hard Republican (but not in the American sense) - up against the wall with 'em, I say), but your post piqued my interest on a couple of matters.
Firstly I just thought I'd mention that it's interesting that you state Anderson's Thatcher is perhaps overwrought and carries a self-awareness of performance, because you could easily argue that Thatcher's own public persona was also an affectation. Long story short, she was the first woman of significance in the UK's monied old-boy network of politicians, but came in for a lot of stick in her formative years for being a greengrocer's daughter from a nowheresville town. She worked with a vocal coach to create a stern, posher voice that might carry more authority, worked hard on commanding a room, had a small coterie of make-up and dressers to craft a look and (this is where claims of feminism meet with traction) she only moved one female MP into her cabinet in her full eleven year reign, so the very nature of her being a woman in politics stands out. I barely know anyone who hasn't had a stab at a Thatcher impression (from the full range of fondness to fire-behind-the-eyes), so I don't envy anyone having to portray her as a three-dimensional person.
Secondly, she's suddenly become a news item again on account of the imminent raising of a bronze statue of her in said nowheresville town. In the past few weeks I've been added to the team at Grantham Council but working from home as my usual job is still in a state of trying-futilely-to-open, and we actually had to set up a standardised response to all the angry calls we've received in the light of its proposal. It's already been decided that it'll be mounted on a 10' plinth in light of statuegate and yesterday I took a call from an extremely agitated resident (he was ostensibly ringing up about refuse collection) who went off on quite the tangent about it ("As you can tell by my voice, I'm a Northener, so you can guess how I feel about a bloody statue of 'er"). Always a good idea to bring in a crowbar to an already-divided nation.
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Post by Jeremy on Dec 8, 2020 11:04:07 GMT -8
So I've never watched The Crown (I'm a die-hard Republican (but not in the American sense) Funnily enough, I was reading an interview last month with Josh O'Connor (the actor who plays Prince Charles on the show), and he described himself as "very liberal" and also "a Republican." Being the ignorant American that I am, I was quite confused. I feel like Brits purposely give themselves conflicting labels to mess with the folks across the pond. Good point about Thatcher; given her own overly mannered composure, it would be difficult for any actress to portray her without feeling at least in part like self-parody. (I remember the stir that was raised over whether Meryl Streep deserved her Oscar for The Iron Lady.) I think the Mrs. America comparison is apt - Cate Blanchett nails Phyllis Schlafly's speaking patterns and mannerisms - but perhaps the difference lies not in portrayal but in tone. If the writers take the character especially seriously, there's a higher bar of authenticity to clear, and little details that don't feel genuine can be distracting. And to that end, The Crown takes Thatcher's character very seriously, while Mrs. America features scenes like this.Maybe I'm being overly critical of Anderson; it's impressive to see her deviate so much from Dana Scully. But the performance still feels like Emmy bait (which has been a large problem with much of The Crown, honestly).
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Post by guttersnipe on Dec 8, 2020 13:01:29 GMT -8
The video itself won't play over here, but I do remember the pieing. Incidentally, I liked that a show called Mrs. America gave its meatiest roles to Brits, Aussies and Kiwis.
If you find the terminology confusing (and I suppose your Republicans do make linguistic sense; they celebrate the overthrow of a monarchy and thus the American Dream is facilitated), consider that our parties use inverse colours (blue=right, red=left). It's the sort of thing that makes it easier for the tabloids to claim that anyone even vaguely left-of-centre is a communist. In any case, I assume that your Democrats don't sing "The Internationale".
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Post by Jeremy on Dec 8, 2020 15:18:02 GMT -8
No, but don't give them ideas. I was indeed thinking of the reversed colors when I wrote that comment. Whenever I see a UK ad saying "vote red" or "vote blue," I always have to pause and switch the colors in my head. (Good thing some of the third parties in America are more straightforward; we have a green party that is called... the Green Party.) Oh, and here's another clip of the Mrs. America scene which is (hopefully) not cut down by international law. For some reason, I find Blanchett's line at the end of the clip to feel a little forced (even though it is the line that the real Schlafly said in that scenario). Sometimes it's best to tweak history a bit.
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Post by guttersnipe on Dec 8, 2020 16:00:58 GMT -8
(Good thing some of the third parties in America are more straightforward; we have a green party that is called... the Green Party.) Snap! I think ours gain about as much ground in elections as yours (ie next-to-none), though green parties in various European countries can merge into a kind of federation for substantial representation in the Parliament. With regards to the colour associations again, recently-exiled Brexit "mastermind" Dominic Cummings intentionally used red advertising for his Vote Leave campaign even though it had far more standing with the right so as to suggest a kind of grassroots working-class resistance. (That was actually spearheaded by the 1% and trusted to be implemented by the born-into-privilege.) I don't know how much IRL attention you intend to expend upon this island, but right now left-leaning Scottish independence has never ridden so high in favour, topping nearly every poll this year, though actual moves in that direction are on hold until Covid becomes a thing of the past.
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Post by Jeremy on Dec 8, 2020 17:26:40 GMT -8
I think ours gain about as much ground in elections as yours (ie next-to-none), though green parties in various European countries can merge into a kind of federation for substantial representation in the Parliament. Our Green Party has grown in popularity over the last few elections, though their support dropped quite a bit in 2020. They did not qualify for ballots in many states, presumably because Democrats were worried that the extra party could split voters from Biden and give a second term to Trump, and thus convinced activists in many states to dial it back for this election. I've heard a bit about Scotland's proposed break from the EU (it hasn't caught on as much on Twitter, since "Scexit" is not as catchy as "Brexit"). Still, I confess that my knowledge of non-US politics remains pretty spotty. (I've learned a fair deal about 20th-century British history simply from watching The Crown.) Incidentally, I've been watching Mank just now and the film features an extended conversation about socialism and communism, which ends with a punchline about "The Internationale." Were it not for your earlier comment, I probably wouldn't have laughed.
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Quiara
Grade School
Posts: 775
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Post by Quiara on Dec 8, 2020 20:53:32 GMT -8
I think ours gain about as much ground in elections as yours (ie next-to-none), though green parties in various European countries can merge into a kind of federation for substantial representation in the Parliament. Our Green Party has grown in popularity over the last few elections, though their support dropped quite a bit in 2020. They did not qualify for ballots in many states, presumably because Democrats were worried that the extra party could split voters from Biden and give a second term to Trump, and thus convinced activists in many states to dial it back for this election. I've heard a bit about Scotland's proposed break from the EU (it hasn't caught on as much on Twitter, since "Scexit" is not as catchy as "Brexit"). Still, I confess that my knowledge of non-US politics remains pretty spotty. (I've learned a fair deal about 20th-century British history simply from watching The Crown.) Incidentally, I've been watching Mank just now and the film features an extended conversation about socialism and communism, which ends with a punchline about "The Internationale." Were it not for your earlier comment, I probably wouldn't have laughed. I've got to say, for a movie that otherwise screams OSCAR BAIT, Mank's extended subplot about media companies conspiring with the ultra-rich to sink the political campaign of a prominent socialist is... somewhat curious.
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Post by guttersnipe on Dec 9, 2020 1:08:18 GMT -8
I've heard a bit about Scotland's proposed break from the EU (it hasn't caught on as much on Twitter, since "Scexit" is not as catchy as "Brexit"). You mean from the UK. Scotland is overwhelmingly pro-European, so the intention, if approved, is to secede from the UK and rejoin the EU at the earliest opportunity. The circumstances of Brexit are still (still!) as mutable as they were in 2016, and with a dreadful handling of Covid and a Trump defeat, variables just keep the tug-of-war going. We'll have to see how Biden's influence will shape the united Ireland proposal, which is a harder task given the Catholic/Protestant divide. Damn, you guys have seen Mank already? That might end up being the first Fincher I don't get to see at the cinema for twenty years.
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Post by Jeremy on Dec 9, 2020 12:27:37 GMT -8
You mean from the UK. See my previous comment about my knowledge of non-US politics. It's pretty clear that I'm not going to be going to the cinema until next year at the earliest, though honestly, I'm not sure I would have enjoyed Mank on the big screen. (It's streaming on Netflix.) I've enjoyed the other Fincher films I've seen, but - despite my interest in the subject matter - I didn't much care for his latest film.
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