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Post by ThirdMan on Nov 29, 2019 20:51:44 GMT -8
Knives Out is good, but it's not gonna have anywhere near the cultural impact or visibility of Get Out. So unless you specifically go looking for spoilers, I doubt you'll find them.
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Post by Jeremy on Dec 1, 2019 16:30:59 GMT -8
Do you think this film is going to end up like that other movie with racial subtext-that-becomes-text and a second act twist with "Out" in the title, where the internet will spoil it for me before I can get it on DVD? I doubt it. I think there are some alt-right trolls who are trying to spoil the ending because they hate the film's pro-immigration message, but heck with them. Beyond that, this film isn't going to generate nearly the same buzz that Peele's did. On a slightly related note - Quiara, have you seen Dora and the Lost City of Gold? It's out on DVD now, and it's a lot of fun. It's got a great sense of goofy, absurdist humor and a perfect lead performance from Isabella Moner. Every year, there's always one kiddie/family film that's much better than I expect it to be, and Dora hits that mark for 2019.
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Quiara
Grade School
Posts: 775
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Post by Quiara on Dec 7, 2019 12:03:12 GMT -8
Do you think this film is going to end up like that other movie with racial subtext-that-becomes-text and a second act twist with "Out" in the title, where the internet will spoil it for me before I can get it on DVD? I doubt it. I think there are some alt-right trolls who are trying to spoil the ending because they hate the film's pro-immigration message, but heck with them. Beyond that, this film isn't going to generate nearly the same buzz that Peele's did. On a slightly related note - Quiara, have you seen Dora and the Lost City of Gold? It's out on DVD now, and it's a lot of fun. It's got a great sense of goofy, absurdist humor and a perfect lead performance from Isabella Moner. Every year, there's always one kiddie/family film that's much better than I expect it to be, and Dora hits that mark for 2019. Nope - no nostalgia for la exploradora here. How much does it lean into making fun of the audience-participation aspect of a decade-plus-old TV show?
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Post by Jeremy on Dec 7, 2019 16:41:49 GMT -8
There are some jokes about that, though not to the point of overdoing it. The film paints her as a teenage Lara Croft with a chipper attitude and penchant for musical numbers, and it maintains that balance impressively well. (There's even a scene that's animated in the style of the TV show, except... more PG-rated.)
It's from the same writer and director as the recent Muppet movies, so there's a lot of tongue-in-cheekiness. It feels the kind of film that'll develop a cult status someday.
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Post by Jeremy on Dec 31, 2019 18:10:05 GMT -8
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Post by ThirdMan on Jan 1, 2020 1:06:57 GMT -8
Hey, I'm glad to see I was correct in thinking you'd enjoy OUaTiH. Once you take Sam Jackson out of a QT film, the level of profanity drops by, like, 80% (heh). That aside, the period detail is tremendous, and it really is a whole lot of fun. I'm sure you were slightly traumatized by the few minutes of brutal violence towards the end, but it's not like the individuals, in relation to their real-world counterparts, didn't have it coming. And it's not like they didn't foreshadow the flamethrower bit earlier. And Brad Pitt's always funny playing stoned: earlier example, Tony Scott's (with a script from QT) True Romance.
Two questions:
1) Did you find Rick's interaction with the precocious child actress in any way creepy (I didn't, but some viewers did)?
2) Did you think the scene with (the actor playing) Bruce Lee was out-of-line? Lee's estate, of course, got all up-in-arms, but as his family is (financially) living off his legacy, of course they don't want him to be seen as a bit arrogant or foolish. But Lee DID have a run-in with a Hollywood stuntman back in the day, who taught him a thing or two about close-quarter fighting (one of his weaknesses in combat terms, apparently).
On a side note, I very much enjoyed Knives Out as well, but it didn't quite has as much visual flair as I was hoping for. Still, solid character work and clever (if more than a little far-fetched) plotting.
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Post by guttersnipe on Jan 1, 2020 1:47:48 GMT -8
I had a massive issue that I ended up verbally discussing over ...Hollywood several times over the last few months, usually couched in a contextual discourse about the surrounding two years of Hollywood history - the story of William Castle's career is by far the most important for the milieu, despite his outright abscence (even in dialogue) from Tarantino's film. My little seminars usually took up about forty minutes and resulted in an agreement that it would be unfair for me to take part in the film quiz hosted that same quarter (in fact I had to correct the quizmasters on a couple of questions they got wrong).
Anyway, I came to discover a peculiar correlation that the film seemed to go down better with people unfamiliar with Sharon Tate, Bruce Lee, poliziotteschi or even QT himself, and conversely felt less rewarding for cinephiles, despite (or perhaps because of) the wealth of opportunity to spot his cinematic magpieing. In effect, this has the opposite result to what I'd usually expect from a Tarantino film.
When I don't have the time to knuckle down to it, I usually just claim I felt "conflicted".
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Post by guttersnipe on Jan 1, 2020 2:03:21 GMT -8
2) Did you think the scene with (the actor playing) Bruce Lee was out-of-line? I don't know about out-of-line but I felt awkward about the surrounding audiences (I saw it off my own back and then had to hastily cover an usher's shift a few days later) laughing at his vocalisations, much in the same way that I felt about a modern audience still laughing at Mickey Rooney's Mr. Yunioshi (a depiction challenged in the interim in Dragon: The Bruce Lee Story, no less), like I'd just travelled back to the 1970s to relish gags like these: "Excuse me, are you Sikhs?" "No no no, sir (head-wobble). He is six, I am eight."
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Post by ThirdMan on Jan 1, 2020 2:52:16 GMT -8
Anyway, I came to discover a peculiar correlation that the film seemed to go down better with people unfamiliar with Sharon Tate, Bruce Lee, poliziotteschi or even QT himself, and conversely felt less rewarding for cinephiles, despite (or perhaps because of) the wealth of opportunity to spot his cinematic magpieing. Well, that's interesting, because I've read a ton of reviews from older critics who would absolutely qualify as cinephiles (being well-versed and knowledgeable about films from the past 120 years, as well as the many eras of Hollywood) who count it among their favourite films from QT. Some of them certainly take issue with the historical revisionism of the final section, but nonetheless find the overall work quite pleasurable. Re: the Bruce Lee thing, yeah, there will always be audience members who are casually racist. But I think some (overly sensitive?) folks simply objected to a white stuntman briefly getting the physical upper-hand on an acclaimed Asian martial artist (even though something of that nature did indeed occur). I admit to not investigating as to whether Lee ever talked shit about Muhammad Ali, though...heh.
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Post by guttersnipe on Jan 1, 2020 5:22:26 GMT -8
Fair enough; I don't really read film reviews, and I have no idea if critics liked ...Hollywood or not. I was merely referring my circle, if my little window unto the world is anything to go by - the guys who don't really care for film enjoyed it whereas the cineastes were often harsh (a lot more so than me, as the consensus seemed to be "What was the point?", wherein I would step in to defend it).
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Post by Jeremy on Jan 1, 2020 6:40:03 GMT -8
I actually spoke to a non-cinephile friend recently who hated the film. His main complaint was the lack of a driving narrative. And it's true the film doesn't have much in the way of plot, but it's clearly more focused on characters and atmosphere.
J.C. - yeah, this is the first Tarantino film I've seen that I not only really liked, but wouldn't mind rewatching at some point. The violence at the end is... a bit over-the-top, but I've seen worse. And in context, it's kind of fun watching Tarantino play out "what should have happened." (And it's weirdly cathartic to watch one of the daughters from Better Things get incinerated.) The only downside is that Roman Polanski survives, but I guess we can't have everything.
In regards to your Q's:
1) I didn't find it creepy at all. At first, I actually found the child actress (meaning the character, not the actress who plays her) to be kind of annoying, though I figured this was Tarantino's commentary on how some child stars tend to think they own the world. But her interactions with DiCaprio soon became amusing. I guess I see where the complaints would come from, but I think people are reading something that isn't there.
2) I actually thought the Bruce Lee fight scene was one of the film's comedic highlights. As you say, it's based on a true event, and both Pitt and the Lee stand-in have a lot of fun playing it out. And the scene ends with Cliff getting fired, so I'd say Bruce was technically the winner.
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Post by guttersnipe on Jan 1, 2020 9:17:58 GMT -8
The only downside is that Roman Polanski survives, but I guess we can't have everything. Oh-ho? He's one of the greatest directors who ever lived; if you're advocating his destruction based on a certain event post-1969 isn't that a bit kill-baby-Hitler?
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Post by Jeremy on Jan 1, 2020 10:46:30 GMT -8
I just think the world would be better off without his Oliver Twist remake.
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Post by ThirdMan on Jan 1, 2020 17:07:13 GMT -8
Jeremy -
Yeah, it probably would've been even MORE cathartic if it was the middle-child (Frankie) from Better Things who got the blowtorch. Speaking of uber-annoying teen characters...heh.
Re: Rick and the child actress's interactions, yeah, it's just the culture we live in, sadly, where if a grown man says anything to a random kid who isn't a family member, people start wondering if they're up to something. I won't even say anything to a kid who's a fair distance from their parents, unless they say "Hi", in which case I'll say "Hi" back and continue on my way. Who needs the (potential) aggravation?
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Post by Jeremy on Jan 1, 2020 20:26:32 GMT -8
Yeah, our culture isn't at its best. I don't typically have lengthy conversations with kids myself, unless they want to talk about cartoons. (I am always up for that.)
Also, I just noticed that there's a funny scene during the end credits of OUaTiH that features DiCaprio riffing on old-time cigarette ads, underscoring the way celebrities were used to market the stuff back then. And the credits close with the Batman theme! This movie's awesome.
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